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Reload this Page 1500cc Triumph & cooling
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2006, 01:24 PM
glennyrosa
 
Posts: n/a
1500cc Triumph & cooling


My last post of the desire of more hp led me to the Amphicar
website. I had read where the 1500 Spitfire engine would bolt right
in. Further investigation indicates that the 1500 has a cooling
problem. Right now my temp stays pretty much in the center except
when pulling long hills or asking for too much power on the water
which converts gas to noise with no speed increase. I guess that
I'm pretty lucky in that respect when it comes to cooling from
listening to the whoas of others with serious problems in that
area. We have had triple digit temps in the NW this summer and the
thought of adding an electric cooling fan has never crossed my
mind. Whose to say that my temp gage or sending unit isn't fubar.
I could be sailing in bliss whilst I burn up my motor.

It sounds as if I should leave well enough alone and to avoid steep
ramps. I would be interested in hearing from others who have or
have tried the Spitfire engine. My experience with putting larger
engines in airplanes has led mostly to disappointment. Either the
performance improvement was too little gain for the expense, or the
flight characteristics went from good to something of a lesser
value. Not always. But mostly.

One thought: I have never driven my Amphi with the top up. Could
the top create a boundry layer or a reverse flow of turulent air
that inhibits the intake of cooling air? I could vision a dead area
over the loovers where there would be no ram air effect in cruise.
It would be like running your car with a load on the engine but not
moving. Anyone remember riding in the back of a pickup truck and
finding that one spot where the wind doesn't blow at all? Just a
thought.

glenn




        
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2006, 01:24 PM
glennyrosa
 
Posts: n/a
1500cc Triumph & cooling


My last post of the desire of more hp led me to the Amphicar
website. I had read where the 1500 Spitfire engine would bolt right
in. Further investigation indicates that the 1500 has a cooling
problem. Right now my temp stays pretty much in the center except
when pulling long hills or asking for too much power on the water
which converts gas to noise with no speed increase. I guess that
I'm pretty lucky in that respect when it comes to cooling from
listening to the whoas of others with serious problems in that
area. We have had triple digit temps in the NW this summer and the
thought of adding an electric cooling fan has never crossed my
mind. Whose to say that my temp gage or sending unit isn't fubar.
I could be sailing in bliss whilst I burn up my motor.

It sounds as if I should leave well enough alone and to avoid steep
ramps. I would be interested in hearing from others who have or
have tried the Spitfire engine. My experience with putting larger
engines in airplanes has led mostly to disappointment. Either the
performance improvement was too little gain for the expense, or the
flight characteristics went from good to something of a lesser
value. Not always. But mostly.

One thought: I have never driven my Amphi with the top up. Could
the top create a boundry layer or a reverse flow of turulent air
that inhibits the intake of cooling air? I could vision a dead area
over the loovers where there would be no ram air effect in cruise.
It would be like running your car with a load on the engine but not
moving. Anyone remember riding in the back of a pickup truck and
finding that one spot where the wind doesn't blow at all? Just a
thought.

glenn




        
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
GORDON IMPORTS INC.. The world's largest source of Amphicar parts and accessories. Visit our new website today.
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2006, 01:32 PM
ECR staff
 
Posts: n/a
Re: 1500cc Triumph & cooling


I'd like some expert advice on the 1500cc install/ cooling as well.
Is it doable with aluminum rads and such. When you search the web
there appears to be a couple of sites that say it won't work, but
these could be outdated and/or they could have been talking about
putting a 1500 into an Amphi with a neglected old radiator.
What is the real scoop o'mighty experts. Some extra torque seems like
a welcome thing to me.




ECR
21 Tolman Road, Warren, ME 04864
ph: 207-594-8086 fax: 207-594-8120

http://www.eastcoastrover.com

ECR emails are for information exchange only, they are not quotes or
estimates. All work at ECR is done on a time and materials basis.
Install costs and overall project costs can not be given as used and
vintage vehicles vary greatly in condition.

http://www.eastcoastrover.com/FAQ.html

We suggest all 1993-1995 NAS Defender owners read this page:
http://www.eastcoastrover.com/110oillines.html




        
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
GORDON IMPORTS INC.. The world's largest source of Amphicar parts and accessories. Visit our new website today.
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2006, 01:32 PM
ECR staff
 
Posts: n/a
Re: 1500cc Triumph & cooling


I'd like some expert advice on the 1500cc install/ cooling as well.
Is it doable with aluminum rads and such. When you search the web
there appears to be a couple of sites that say it won't work, but
these could be outdated and/or they could have been talking about
putting a 1500 into an Amphi with a neglected old radiator.
What is the real scoop o'mighty experts. Some extra torque seems like
a welcome thing to me.




ECR
21 Tolman Road, Warren, ME 04864
ph: 207-594-8086 fax: 207-594-8120

http://www.eastcoastrover.com

ECR emails are for information exchange only, they are not quotes or
estimates. All work at ECR is done on a time and materials basis.
Install costs and overall project costs can not be given as used and
vintage vehicles vary greatly in condition.

http://www.eastcoastrover.com/FAQ.html

We suggest all 1993-1995 NAS Defender owners read this page:
http://www.eastcoastrover.com/110oillines.html




        
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
GORDON IMPORTS INC.. The world's largest source of Amphicar parts and accessories. Visit our new website today.
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2006, 03:25 PM
a_colo_native
 
Posts: n/a
Re: 1500cc Triumph & cooling


THE major problem with the 1500cc in an Amphi is the piston speed. The
1500cc is a stroked 1300cc. The low gears of the Amphi will raise the
RPMs up and the piston speed (the speed that the pistons go to the
top, reverses direction and goes to the bottom of the stroke) is
enough that it could cause the the pistons to grenade or come apart.
They can't take that for long because the pistons travel further in
the same amount of time as the 1147 or 1300.

A better choice is the 1300cc. It does not have the cooling concerns
and it can take the higher RPMs of the Amphi at hiway speeds. Look for
the large journal 1300 model.

There are others here who can give you more in depth info on these
engines.

John Bevins
Rocky Mountain Amphicar
Webmaster IAOC




        
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
GORDON IMPORTS INC.. The world's largest source of Amphicar parts and accessories. Visit our new website today.
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2006, 03:25 PM
a_colo_native
 
Posts: n/a
Re: 1500cc Triumph & cooling


THE major problem with the 1500cc in an Amphi is the piston speed. The
1500cc is a stroked 1300cc. The low gears of the Amphi will raise the
RPMs up and the piston speed (the speed that the pistons go to the
top, reverses direction and goes to the bottom of the stroke) is
enough that it could cause the the pistons to grenade or come apart.
They can't take that for long because the pistons travel further in
the same amount of time as the 1147 or 1300.

A better choice is the 1300cc. It does not have the cooling concerns
and it can take the higher RPMs of the Amphi at hiway speeds. Look for
the large journal 1300 model.

There are others here who can give you more in depth info on these
engines.

John Bevins
Rocky Mountain Amphicar
Webmaster IAOC




        
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
GORDON IMPORTS INC.. The world's largest source of Amphicar parts and accessories. Visit our new website today.
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2006, 04:15 PM
ECR staff
 
Posts: n/a
Re: 1500cc Triumph & cooling


>
>A better choice is the 1300cc. It does not have the cooling concerns
>and it can take the higher RPMs of the Amphi at hiway speeds. Look for
>the large journal 1300 model.

What about punching out the smaller engines to larger bore?
I guess my bigger question is: Do performance mods to a 1147 or 1300
automatically mean overheat issues like some suggest, or with a
proper build and cooling add ons (alloy radiator and elec.fans) can
it mean a cool running Amphi.
I think I usually hear from originality folks and they all scream
"Don't do that!". I'm all for those who want originality, but I'm not
one of them. I want modern function with a classic look.
Thoughts?


ECR
21 Tolman Road, Warren, ME 04864
ph: 207-594-8086 fax: 207-594-8120

http://www.eastcoastrover.com

ECR emails are for information exchange only, they are not quotes or
estimates. All work at ECR is done on a time and materials basis.
Install costs and overall project costs can not be given as used and
vintage vehicles vary greatly in condition.

http://www.eastcoastrover.com/FAQ.html

We suggest all 1993-1995 NAS Defender owners read this page:
http://www.eastcoastrover.com/110oillines.html




        
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
GORDON IMPORTS INC.. The world's largest source of Amphicar parts and accessories. Visit our new website today.
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2006, 04:15 PM
ECR staff
 
Posts: n/a
Re: 1500cc Triumph & cooling


>
>A better choice is the 1300cc. It does not have the cooling concerns
>and it can take the higher RPMs of the Amphi at hiway speeds. Look for
>the large journal 1300 model.

What about punching out the smaller engines to larger bore?
I guess my bigger question is: Do performance mods to a 1147 or 1300
automatically mean overheat issues like some suggest, or with a
proper build and cooling add ons (alloy radiator and elec.fans) can
it mean a cool running Amphi.
I think I usually hear from originality folks and they all scream
"Don't do that!". I'm all for those who want originality, but I'm not
one of them. I want modern function with a classic look.
Thoughts?


ECR
21 Tolman Road, Warren, ME 04864
ph: 207-594-8086 fax: 207-594-8120

http://www.eastcoastrover.com

ECR emails are for information exchange only, they are not quotes or
estimates. All work at ECR is done on a time and materials basis.
Install costs and overall project costs can not be given as used and
vintage vehicles vary greatly in condition.

http://www.eastcoastrover.com/FAQ.html

We suggest all 1993-1995 NAS Defender owners read this page:
http://www.eastcoastrover.com/110oillines.html




        
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
GORDON IMPORTS INC.. The world's largest source of Amphicar parts and accessories. Visit our new website today.
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2006, 04:23 PM
David Chapman
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Re: 1500cc Triumph & cooling



Power equals heat - no way of avoiding that. A bigger or more efficient radiator is only part of the issue. Have to get heat away from the exhaust area and try and keep the transmission cool. Possible but difficult. The biggest problem with the 1500 is that it is never smooth. It's like going from a 6 cylinder to a 4 cylinder car. Same problem to some extent with the 1300 with the large crank. There is too much weight being thrown about in all directions by the huge crank for it to be as smooth as the 1147, especially at high revs.

The small crank 1300 is best - not quite as powerfull as 1500 but a lot more than 1147 and retains the smoothness.

Alternative is to tune the 1147, lots can be done. More info here:

www.amphicars.com/actengin.htm

David C




        
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
GORDON IMPORTS INC.. The world's largest source of Amphicar parts and accessories. Visit our new website today.
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2006, 04:23 PM
David Chapman
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Re: 1500cc Triumph & cooling



Power equals heat - no way of avoiding that. A bigger or more efficient radiator is only part of the issue. Have to get heat away from the exhaust area and try and keep the transmission cool. Possible but difficult. The biggest problem with the 1500 is that it is never smooth. It's like going from a 6 cylinder to a 4 cylinder car. Same problem to some extent with the 1300 with the large crank. There is too much weight being thrown about in all directions by the huge crank for it to be as smooth as the 1147, especially at high revs.

The small crank 1300 is best - not quite as powerfull as 1500 but a lot more than 1147 and retains the smoothness.

Alternative is to tune the 1147, lots can be done. More info here:

www.amphicars.com/actengin.htm

David C




        
 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
GORDON IMPORTS INC.. The world's largest source of Amphicar parts and accessories. Visit our new website today.
 



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